Pte John Payne 7327

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Pte John Payne 7327

Postby Silver640 » Wed Oct 26, 2011 5:10 pm

Hello,

I'm investigating my Grandfather
John Payne
His number was 7327
2nd Worcestershire Regiment
I found the medals he was awarded online at the
National Archives.(got his number there as well).

he joined 12 August 1914
discharged 16 January 1920
(if I'm reading this right).

I'm interested in finding out where he spent the war?

Leave a message if you know the answer.

Thanks,
Edward Holland
Silver640
 
Posts: 2
Joined: Wed Oct 26, 2011 4:38 pm
Location: Ontario, Canada

Re: Pte John Payne 7327

Postby Mike Jones » Fri Oct 28, 2011 3:47 am

Hello Edward,
We share a link from many years ago. My grandfather was also a 2nd Bn. Worcestershire man in 1914. Our Grandfathers left for France together on 12th August 1914. Unfortunately you have read that Medal Index Card (MIC) wrongly. Pte. John Payne 7327 joined the Regiment on 26th June 1905. The 12th of August was the date he Landed in France to stem the German Rush across Belgium/France. I think he did appear on a casualty list in 1914. Allan Parry is the expert on these very long lists. I am sure he will be along later with any details for you.. Your Grandfather was discharged from any further military service on 29th July 1915. He was awarded a Silver War Badge (SWB) because of sickness not wounds. So he must have been a very sick man. The 16th January 1920 date you saw was the date the Clasp to his 1914 was issued to him. Not many men got the Clasp. You had to apply for it yourself, it was NOT automatic (Like the medal was). It showed you were within range of German Field guns before 22nd November 1914. A very early combatant. To get the Clasp you had to prove entitlement. Which meant you had to get someone who held the rank of Sgt. or above to confirm you were there. Of course many men, though they were there, could not locate anyone who survived to confirm them ! Only about one in five of the men entitled got their Clasp. Anyhow John got his. He has his name in Gold leaf in Worcester Cathedral. It is on the Embarkation Roll of the 2nd. Bn.. This is all the men who left for France during August 1914. He is Number 870 on the Roll of 1203 men. One in three of these men were dead before the War ended. He is number 824 on the 2nd Bn. 1914 Star Roll of 1564 men. The 1914 Star is more commonly known as the Mons Star. There are some excellent Fotos of the Cathedral Roll on this website. Find it and you will see your grandfathers name in Gold. My grandfather Pte R. Marsh is number 781 0n the Cathedral Roll . Hope this helps with your research.
Regards Mike
Mike Jones
Mike Jones
 
Posts: 325
Joined: Mon Sep 25, 2006 12:00 am
Location: Kent

Re: Pte John Payne 7327

Postby Silver640 » Sun Oct 30, 2011 9:17 pm

Thanks Mike for all the information on John Payne.

That's A LOT of information I knew nothing about!!

Do you have John Payne's Attestation Papers? I couldn't find them.

Would John Payne have been in the 2nd Worcester Reg in 1905?

I'm very surprised at John Payne signing up in 1905.

Where did John Payne spend the years from 1915-1920?

Thanks in advance,
Edward Holland
Silver640
 
Posts: 2
Joined: Wed Oct 26, 2011 4:38 pm
Location: Ontario, Canada

Re: Pte John Payne 7327

Postby Mike Jones » Mon Oct 31, 2011 12:06 am

Hi Edward,
Glad i could help put some flesh on the story. No I do not have his attestation papers. I got most of the information from his Silver War badge entry details. There are about 9 columns of information, including date he enlisted. Have you tried Ancestry for his service record? You have a 40% chance they are there. It would take more research to discover his Bn. But again it would be on his service record. You could also try the 1911 census. It included soldiers in barracks, even if they were in India. John Payne left the Army in 1915 , so he was back to civvy life. The reference to 1920 was when his medals were sent out. A date similar to all soldiers, even the ones killed in Action. in 1919/20 their medals got sent to next of Kin.
Regards Mike
Mike Jones
Mike Jones
 
Posts: 325
Joined: Mon Sep 25, 2006 12:00 am
Location: Kent


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